The Gaff

[Sinbad]

Chaps - thought I'd ask for advice,

 

I made a gaff some time ago, from a broom handle, with a hook bolted through and wire siezed onto the end...

Mainly to avoid the problem I had a few years ago with a conger which was larger than my net - there ensued a struggle with half a netted fish, a mono trace wrapped round my hand, and plenty of grunting.

There's not been much conversation on this subject, but are these items considered necessary, as I know some skippers prefer to carry a long net ?

 

Whats the best place to gaff a Conger? Ray? - and is this a reasonable thing to do for a fish you plan to weigh and release.

 

No doubt, I'll be told...

 

Thanks

 

Paul F

[Coddy]

Hi Paul

 

I don't know about congers but I have been out with Davy Holt a couple of times catching common skate in Scotland and he often uses a gaff to bring in the fish onto the boat.

 

Now Davy is an expert in his field and he gaffs his rays in the wing near the leading edge (front part of the wing). Apparently these heal very quickly and has no lasting effect on the fish.

Most of his fish, however are 150lb+!!

 

Common skate were once common around this area and it would not surprise me if there were a very few still about as many people seem to get smashed up on fairly heavy tackle. I am sure if someone made a concentrated effort they might just get one of these beautiful creatures.

 

I too have a gaff on my boat but have yet to ever use it.

 

Coddy

[Maverick Martin]

Simple answer is no need for a gaff get a large net, congers, rays, tope and all fish we are likely to encounter can be accomodated in a net

 

Martin

[TomBettle]

Simple answer is no need for a gaff get a large net, congers, rays, tope and all fish we are likely to encounter can be accomodated in a net

 

Martin

Totally agree with Martin.

 

For the type of fishing we do, we do not encounter fish requiring a gaff.

If you do plan do gaff conger then in the mouth and out of the lower jaw is, I believe the suggested method. However, in practise, trying to do that to 60lb of spinning angry eel is not easy.

 

Get a big net, or simply get good at judging the weight by the side of the boat. They make an awful mess when brought inboard and even for me an estimate of 45lb is close enough. I would hope I'll be within a few pounds.

[Paul D]

I have a large net. As could be seen in the photos of the conger I recently caught. I made the net from stuff that Wedger had procured and works a treat.

It is long enough for the largest eels no problem. ( Have a gaff somewhere onboard but it is quietly corroding away as I always use the net ).

 

[great white]

As other have said the net is thankfully now the prefered choice on nearly all occasions

 

Congers can be chin gaffed but they need to be well played out so that the aim and gaffing can be done as accuratly as possible so the fish can survive.

 

Out of interest Dan caught a good fish when he was eleven that we netted to land it, but I put the gaff through its chin so he could hold it for a photo. None of the angling magazines would publish the pictures because of the gaff.

 

I am sure a junior with a 55lb eel would have won something without it.

 

Charlie

 

 

[Sinbad]

Ok, thanks chaps. The net I inherited with the boat is pretty large - anything bigger, and its not coming aboard - I wish

[great white]

Hi Paul

 

I remember getting a 40lb fish into that net OK for Dan.

 

"anything bigger, and its not coming aboard - I wish " just how big are you wishing for mate

 

It will soon be time when the divers pack up for the winter [Well most of them] and the inshore wrecks can be fished.

 

Tight lines

Charlie

[Mike Fox]

An interesting topic, and one warranting a careful response.

 

We use a large net for 99% of all of our sizeable fish, but do have a gaff for emergencies. Have had to use it three times this year:

- 13lb thornback would NOT go into the net in strong tides, needed gaffing in the wing, and this was quickly despatched for the pot;

- 24lb tope didn't want to come anywhere near the boat, and a gaff in the chin was the only way to get it onboard. It was returned and swam off strongly;

- 30lb+ conger, backing away from the boat at 6' plus, was much too long to control or net, tried to gaff it in the chin from underneath, but snagged and snapped the trace.

 

In general, the big net approach is the one I would advocate, but we carry the largest net we can store onboard. I'm think about changing the netting to something much deeper, to produce a net with a volume (not mouth size) capable of handling conger (chandlers sell suitable netting, I noted recently).

 

On charter boats wrecking in 200'+ most fish with swim bladders are dead or dying when brought to the surface, and I have used the gaff on these to get on board.

 

I have also had nice fish on other boats in shallow water that have been too big for the net on board, and had to be gaffed. I find this a little a bit distressing, and I prefer to despatch the fish quickly if at all possible, as returning them then is not always viable.

 

I'd recommend all boats to net rather than gaff wherever possible, and to carry the biggest net practical to help with this.

 

Mike

[plaicemat]

I fished a wreck with Gordon on Enticer earlier in the year and we had congers of 35lb and 55lb which were both netted without problem in a net smaller than the one I carry. I think, on a 16

[Paul J]

I've got one in case that Giant Cod i keep dreaming about comes along.

 

the Gaff will probably rust out before that happens

 

PJ

[Maverick Martin]

Have never used a gaff and have never had much of a problem getting what I (or Dean) catch into the net....and we catch a few

 

Martin

[alun j.]

.......That's because Martin's got a big net.......on a long pole.......and you have to be pretty strong to wield it [empty!!].

 

But ........it works a treat!!!........Thanks Martin!

[duncan]

got a decent net set up and chucked the gaff away.

 

hoop by stainless steve via AdamF

 

net from the states via Coddy

 

handle from B&Q (yellow fibreglass with 2 handle areas) came with a hoe attached which had to be cut off...........

 

it will handle anything outwith sharks and skate swiming in UK waters - including Dave if he falls overboard..............

[TomBettle]

got a decent net set up and chucked the gaff away.

 

hoop by stainless steve via AdamF

 

net from the states via Coddy

 

handle from B&Q (yellow fibreglass with 2 handle areas) came with a hoe attached which had to be cut off...........

 

it will handle anything outwith sharks and skate swiming in UK waters - including Dave if he falls overboard..............

Ditch the Gaff

 

 

 

Even chin gaffing takes a lot of skill and will leave a much bigger hole in a fish you plan to return than the hook does.

Get a decent net and anything yuo want to bring aboard will go in easily.

 

Totally agree with Duncan.

In addition, I know some of you yearn to win the fish of the month comps, but apart from for that reason, why bring 60lb+ of really pee'd off Conger into the boat? It thrashing around will end up in either you or it being hurt. Most of us are experienced anough to be a reasonably accurate judge of weight and with competition aside, I'd take your word for the weight you said it was....

 

Tom

[duncan]

you don't need to bring it aboard if you have a decent net Tom!!!

 

we tend to net eels then weigh them in the net over the side before t-barring them off

 

getting quite a good process flow nowadays

 

trace to hand, lead removed (lessons learnt!), net behind fish, fish in net, line slack, scales onto net, readings noted, scales off, tbar, empty net.

 

downsides - conger slime on net and you loose the odd pound as it's difficult to get everything clear of the water and the net handle unsupported. few photo's

 

upside - safe weight established, fish little stressed, crew little stressed!

 

works on tope too but we tend to bar rays off if they are going back as they get caught up in the net..

[Paul D]

Not convinced I could weigh a 50lb conger over the side of my boat.

 

1) Would be too near the water to lift off the water

2) Would be dangerous having myself and crew hanging over the side with 50lb of live conger weighing us down. ( and at night ! )

 

I have not had any trouble with eels "going beserk" since I learnt to keep them in the net all the time.

 

As for "Most of us are experienced anough to be a reasonably accurate judge of weight and with competition aside, I'd take your word for the weight you said it was...." - I am sure I saw this argument proven incorrect somewhere else before ?

[TomBettle]

I am sure I saw this argument proven incorrect somewhere else before ?

Paul

 

It was never an argument, it was a suggestion as to how I'd happilly not have a Conger, it's slime and blood and muck in my boat in exchange for a good guestimation of the weight.

 

If people truly want to weigh their fish then that is up to them, but personally a good guess is fine as I am not attempting to particularly impress anyone so if I over estimate then who am I fooling, but myself?

 

I am not fussed about winning a rod or having a trophy so it doesn't botherme if my weights don't count for anything apart from a asimpe record of the catch.

If people want to win prizes then weigh your fish... like I said, it was never an argument.

 

Tom

Edited October 17, 2007 by TomBettle

[duncan]

Tom,

 

I think Paul, quite rightly, is highlighting the absolute need for a fish to be weighed in acordance with documented procedures if it is to be registered. No if's, no buts, no estimates.

 

Obviously there is no requirement whatsoever for all fish to be weighed and many many entries in the catch report sections make reference to fish 'estimated at' and 'about' x weight.

 

I am amazed that this keeps coming up - and you did bring it up. In doing so you risk confusing people - hence the responses you keep getting.

 

I've not got drawn on the accuracy of estimates before because I have simply stayed out of it but recent experiences have confirmed my previous view that whilst some very experienced people can hold a fish (or other object) and relatively accurately estimate the weight you have no chance of doing this consistently with such as huss, tope and conger which wont sit still (even in a sling!) and that some estimates can be miles out - we had 2 examples this weekend where a huss that Dave estimated at a good 12 went 8lb 10oz and a conger of around 30 was 20lb 8oz. We were both amazed and weighed them over and over again! In the case of the huss the next 4 over the side all came up heavier than estimated - we only weighed them because we were confused by the first. Dave has 'some' experience in such estimating.

 

Paul - absolutely agree that I should have made an approprite comment re size of boat etc when highlighting the above practice. It's all to easy to forget the differences between boats and the potential safety implications. On Phaeton, and most craft with self draining decks, the big problem is just how far down the water is - not how close! Tight lines.

[TomBettle]

Duncan

 

In no way was i trying to confuse or argue with anyone.

In fact I thought I made it abundantly clear that if the fish was for some trophy or other then of course it needs weighing, however for just fun fishing and where I or others don't give a hoot about winning a rod for the fish of the month I am happy if someone writes a eport saying it was about 12lb or the fish were in the 30 to 40 lb bracket.

 

As far as I am concerened that makes great reading and is a lot more interesting that saying it was 4lb 6oz and 2drms.

 

Again, for those that want to fish for trophies then all dues to you, weigh your fish, I'd rather get a rough idea from fish that I don't plan to keep and then cause them as little stress as possible.

 

Tom

[Paul D]

Tom,

 

The argument ( or rather "discussion" ) I would have is that I do not consider that most are actually capable of accurately guessing a weight of a fish ( I certainly include myself in that category as well ). Maybe I see a comp coming here

 

Also as Fish Recorder I have to make it quite clear that EVERY fish recorded in the book needs to be weighed on board or on land or to be recorded as weight estimated.

 

I agree, that if not interested in recording then no need to weigh. ( Indeed my best Tope of est. 30lb I did exactly that ).

 

I wouldn't want someone causing a fuss if their non-weighed fish was not accepted for the book as its weight was estimated.

[great white]

Without any wish to restart an old discussion, wind anyone up or hijack the original thread

 

I think that Paul and Duncan and others have as the saying goes hit the nail on the head.

 

If Members wish to record a catch to keep us all informed of how the general fishing is going that is very welcome.

 

If the fish are to be entered for any of the Club comps including Species trophy or fish of the month or for Club Records then they need to be weighed and witnessed.

 

However if the Member is not interested in trophys for the fish. the weight/size can be estimated and the fish still recorded in the book as an estimated entry for interest only.

 

Perhaps with the constant input of new Members this needs to be noted somewhere [ on the competition list and rules?] so that they can be aware of the policy.

 

Charlie