Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 Hi Tony Sorry I didn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul D Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 And how about answering the questions I and others have asked earlier ? 1) How many cod do you estimate RSA took from the brittle stars then ? 2) What is wrong with my calculation re: 2 million ? 3) Where are these "facts" re: sustainable fishing with a ten fold increase in RSA effort ? 4) Why you think our local IFCA needs "sorting out" Can I add to these. 5) How can you influence on how Sea Angling 2012 project progresses if you have been dismissed from the steering group ? 6) What are the views of the UK-RSA regarding bag limits ? 7) Do you have to wear a suit to go to the meeting with the EU commissioner ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Nash Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 I still say fair play to you for being willing to put yourself forward Bob, and I admire your passion and demeanor with your replies .... but ..... I personally feel sick when I see photos of charter boats with the deck covered in dead fish. As much as I did when I saw the recent TV program about discards. Nothing fuels the ANTI fishing brigades fire more than photos of dead fish. My feelings are that there SHOULD be a limit, although I have absolutely no idea how that could/should be set or policed. So I think we are on opposite tables straight away. My feelings on the whole commercial/recreational fisherman is a fairly simplistic (nieve) one; Commercial fishermen take fish from the sea for a living, they have invested millions on their trade and pay a heavy price when they get it wrong (sometimes they pay the ultimate price with their lives). We the public demand fish for our tables and we demand it at a cheap price, which means they have to catch more and more and they have to do it as economically as possible. If there was no market then they wouldn't do it. Recreational Sea Anglers on the other hand do it as a pass time/sport, mainly so we can get a "buzz" by out-witting a fish and we have even started using lighter gear so that the competition is closer and the "buzz" is heightened. How can we complain at being limited just because the commercial guys take what market forces have dictated that they take? or because we only get out once a month/year or whatever. I personally think that we should limit our bag to personal use, we shouldn't be supplying the neighbourhood or work mates with fish. But if that is what you (or anyone else does) then that is your choice. I won't keep fish just because others do (as was said on another thread recently). Incidentally; I dont put my fish back because I have to, I put them back because I want to. I had a big smile on my face as I saw a 10LB Bass swim away after release, but thats not to say that everyone feels the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 1) How many cod do you estimate RSA took from the brittle stars then? At the height I would imagine it to be between six to eight hundred fish a day and the season taking into account the weather a max of twenty days so 1600 fish out of a shoal that numbers many times that amount were it not the case then the catch rate for rod and line would fall. 2) What is wrong with my calculation re: 2 million ? The indication that I got from the article is the area is not dissimilar in size to that of the Brittle Star Ground, hard to equate without the info but I would defiantly question the claim. 3) Where are these "facts" re: sustainable fishing with a tenfold increase in RSA effort? Simple mathematics Paul that is how the scientist do it ie Estimated stock set against known take they do it all the time with the commercial landings and it has been a long excepted fact that the RSA take is less than 2% 4) Why you think our local IFCA needs "sorting out" ? Because Dave Gibson has said as much and he sits on the committee. CFO Iain Carrier has also on more than one occasion been criticized by me over his failure to act on Bass poaching in Langston Harbour the Scallop issue in Poole Harbour and let Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul D Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 Bob, Many thanks for the replies and I am impressed with you enthusiasm. As you say, I don't necessarily agree with all of them but if everyone were the same it would be a sad world. BTW: My last comment was because I recall an article in BFM slating the AT people as being "those men in suits" having discussions with whoever ( I cant recall the exact wording ). I guess UK-RSA are the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 26, 2011 Report Share Posted October 26, 2011 Bob, Many thanks for the replies and I am impressed with you enthusiasm. As you say, I don't necessarily agree with all of them but if everyone were the same it would be a sad world. BTW: My last comment was because I recall an article in BFM slating the AT people as being "those men in suits" having discussions with whoever ( I cant recall the exact wording ). I guess UK-RSA are the same While I have not been impressed with the AT and how they work for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cth Posted October 27, 2011 Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 Bob, Many thanks for the replies and I am impressed with you enthusiasm. As you say, I don't necessarily agree with all of them but if everyone were the same it would be a sad world. BTW: My last comment was because I recall an article in BFM slating the AT people as being "those men in suits" having discussions with whoever ( I cant recall the exact wording ). I guess UK-RSA are the same While I have not been impressed with the AT and how they work for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niggle Posted October 27, 2011 Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 Mother nature seems to be doing a good job lately on controlling bag limits Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 27, 2011 Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 Chris RSA-UK was born as a direct result of AT failings and while I would never say never at this time the truth is the AT are struggling to hold things together, particularly on the sea angling side. Lack of trust, to many of the old guard, lack of consultation in most parts of the country, are just a few complaints levelled at Mr Lloyd. The Yorkshire region is in disarray they are trying desperately to get a South West region set up and have been funded by the MMO to the tune of Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul D Posted October 27, 2011 Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 Bob, We had a presentation by the AT (Mark Lloyd himself) and indeed we have had a presentation by the IFCA as well. No problem with consultation here and the discussion was open and frank. Was UK-RSA not born by people who did not agree with the AT. PS: Did anyone realise why I mentioned suits ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shytalk Posted October 27, 2011 Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 i got it paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Martin Posted October 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2011 So did I Paul and you also said it would be your last comment Welcome Peter Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Yes you obviously have a problem with RSA-UK Paul so come on then what do you see as the problem or problems with the org. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Bob, Many thanks for the replies and I am impressed with you enthusiasm. As you say, I don't necessarily agree with all of them but if everyone were the same it would be a sad world. BTW: My last comment was because I recall an article in BFM slating the AT people as being "those men in suits" having discussions with whoever ( I cant recall the exact wording ). I guess UK-RSA are the same ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Bob, We had a presentation by the AT (Mark Lloyd himself) and indeed we have had a presentation by the IFCA as well. No problem with consultation here and the discussion was open and frank. Was UK-RSA not born by people who did not agree with the AT. PS: Did anyone realise why I mentioned suits ?? I have to say Paul I have yet to meet with anyone who has not got a problem with the Angling Trust. Some have a bigger axe to grind than others none the less during the many debates that I have seen even some of their strongest supporters are at odds with the AT set up. Their own members caused such a fuss that the AT forum was closed down, there was that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Nash Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Bob, most of us here just wanna fish. Politics is for the politicians and millitants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petesnr Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Im taking a back seat from the club at the moment but having browsed the thread I am struck by the fact that sea anglers have made no steps forward in getting unified representation in the last 40 years. The lessons gained from lets say unions is that united we have power and divided we have nothing but inter organisational squabbling. All energy is being directed inwards instead of tackling the only real problem facing the sea angler and that is are there actually going to be any fish left to make our sport worthwhile. The rest of it is just claptrap. Get stuck in behind one organisation warts and all so that we have united representation. As I understand it AT has a voice at government level and is the recognised body for funding. Seems like a no-brainer to me. If AT needs to change it aint going to come from outside--it needs to be changed by a large membership applying pressure in the right way--not via meaningless forums. Now I would just like to go fishing. PeteSnr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Just to go fishing is what I believe we all want and to be left alone to do just that is how it should be. However there are those that craved for RSA recognition and now we have been recognised. Sadly that means those that feel the need to exploit us or govern us are now on our case. To simply ignore that fact is fine until you suddenly find the regulation you could have prevented is now about to prevent you and future generations from doing what has hitherto been an unregulated pass time is frankly unacceptable. For those turned off by politics fine don Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coddy Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 (snip) To much goes on behind closed doors and like it or not the head honcho Mark Lloyd has said he Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Martin Posted October 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Guys this forum is a vehicle to discuss and put across your points but please be aware you are responsible for what you write. We will take down any comments that others find offensive, they only have to ask. Please don't turn me into the forum police, take care in what you post. Martin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Perhaps Mark might like to gag Keith Arthur then. Need I say any more? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Martin Posted October 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Bob I believe you are referring to the article Keith wrote in the Angling Times and a response was forthcoming from the AT as follows: The Angling Trust would like to stress that sea angling is an integral part of the united, single representative body for ALL anglers. Keith Arthur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 Martin I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul D Posted October 28, 2011 Report Share Posted October 28, 2011 you obviously have a problem with RSA-UK Paul so come on then what do you see as the problem or problems with the org. i would rather support an org which has the majority of anglers and our club is affiliated with opposed to a splinter group. I would rather join an org where they believe that tope should not be killed just to make a record claim. You personally think it is ok to do this I note. I don't agree that MCZ are a waste of time. I prefer facts as opposed to heresay and innuendo. ( eg see above posts you didn't even apologise for your misquote ). For the above reasons I am not interested in your org. You wished to educate our members. I suggest you have accomplished that now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Shotter Posted October 29, 2011 Report Share Posted October 29, 2011 Paul you have obviously got a problem with me that was evident before I even knew who you were or the position you hold. I came on this thread as your poll had been brought to my attention by Peter Russell and as I suspected the rational of those who had already voted had done so without perhaps knowing some important facts, as in bag limits for sea anglers are as pointless as it gets. They would make no difference what so ever in the grand scheme of things and to suggest if we take them the commercials would have to do likewise is ridiculous. The idea doesn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J Posted October 29, 2011 Report Share Posted October 29, 2011 Bob, I believe you've had your say, it's time to move on to your next victims, im sure there are plenty of other clubs willing to listen, Im bored of this now PJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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