JIMBOB Posted June 5, 2006 Report Share Posted June 5, 2006 As I just got my film developed I found this picky of Adam in Blue warrior trying to dodge a tanker, nearly mid channel. A little bit close for comfort. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 Always remember; might is right Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan Posted June 6, 2006 Report Share Posted June 6, 2006 in this case the ship has just about everything going for it including being stand on vessel............. however the picture is a little deceiving and Adam clearly decided he was well clear - his call! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted June 7, 2006 Report Share Posted June 7, 2006 When he approached I was the stand on - the picture shows me having moved. But as Simon says - might is right. The crew could even be clearly seen on the bridge and the boat was empty of containers... On the way back Mon eve travelling at 20 knots + back into Christchurch I saw 2 marine personell carriers heading east across the ledge from Poole...the two crew commented that they we on a collision course - they were much bigger (40'+) and doing a similar speed - I calmly (??) commented that I was the stand on vessel and that they would move - the crew didnt seem convinced, but sure enough when the second vessel was sure it was too close he altered course by 20 odd degs. this was my first experinace of holding a course having only learnt the rules from CC on our Alderney trip and it was good to see them observed for once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMac Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Adam, don't you think you ought to share that rule with all us less well informed members? Al Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 OK.... As I understand it - If you imagine sitting in the wheelhouse. Looking straight ahead, divide the boat into 4 segments, or quarters. The first starting at the bow roller and finishing on the s/brd beam, the second from the s/brd beam to the mid of the stern, the third from the mid stern to the mid of the port side beam and the forth and final from the mid of the port beam to the bow roller again. Basically, when underway, any boat approaching you from the last (4th) quarter means you have right of way - you are the STAND ON VESSEL (and visa, versa - if you are approaching another vessel in this position). Anything other than this, means you do not have right of way. You are then either subject to another stand on vessel or you need to pass - port to port if you can. Of course this time of year means that their are lots of boats on the water and it is not a very commonly known rule to weekend boaters - therfore I would advise that if in doubt, slow down and / or be the first to move and change course. Adam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 RNLI Saftey. Try this link. I think we've had it on here before. It tells you all the rules for standing on etc. and you can also test yourself. To find the Rule of the Road part you have to enter the site and then click on the downward pointing arrows and pick out the part you want. Simon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Hopefully this may explain it better. If I have it wrong Im sure one of the others with correct me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Just seen Simon's link! - Much easier. This was just the way CC explained it to me last month. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newboy Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 As said before might is right, the big one is always the stand on vessel, as big ship can't change directions quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Kam - that is not true. Might is right, is a fair assumption, but according to the law of the sea, the size of the ship doesnt have a bearing - only last year did Duncan hold his course to the Condor - sure Pheaton is a large vessel in our terms, but they dont come much bigger and faster than the Condor! - The Condor realised Duncan was stand on and altered course. The RNLI training site also does not mention size. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bootlegger Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Good Thread, Adam is perfectly correct in his presentation of the RR. The presumption of might is right in all cases is incorrect as is the assumption that power always gives way to sail, there are numerous examples of where there are exceptions to both rules of thumb. EG Vessels ability to navigate constarined by depth, vessels manouvering accross channels, veesels under tow etc, etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newboy Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Of cos you're right Adam, size has nothing to do with it (funny that's what the missus been telling me.... ), but in practise it's better and safer to let the big tanker go first. I was fishing Folkestone (can't get much busier than that with cargo ship coming in and out of Dover) on Tuesday, twice the skipper let the big tanker go first even tho we were the stand on vessel, simple reason being you have to assume the tankers know you are there in the first place. All you need is a kamikazee pilot on helm without a proper look out and that will be it, my bet is they won't even notice they hit you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Size shouldn't be an issue unless the vessel in question is 'Constrained by her Draft' or 'Restricted in her ability to manouvre' i.e. in the harbour. When at sea there shouldn't be a problem with large ships obeying hte Rule of the Road even wiht much smaller vessels. Sometimes though, for practicality or reasons of common sense you would not force your right as the 'stand on vessel' when it is obviously easier for you, being a small and easily manouverable vessel, to just nip around the stern of the large vessesl in question. You know what I mean.............. One other important thing is if you are the stand on vessel and you become very close to the vessel who is supposed to be giving way to you on your Port side, you should never alter to Port. You should always alter to Starboard and do a complete circle if necessary; the reason being that the other vessel may alter to starboard at the same time as you're altering to port...........crash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 (edited) I would just like to point out that Adams reference to the Condor wasn't a close call situation! We were some 10 miles out and it had became obvious that we were on course for close encounter after about 3 miles of travelling/monitoring. At about 1.5 miles the condor made a small but clear course correction. At about half a mile I would have taken action, without any real issue. Mid channel in and around the shipping lanes I will make an obvious course correction to pass astern of any crossing ship as soon as it becomes apparant that we are converging. Radar is particularily useful here! Finally if you are ever out and forget/confused just look at your nav lights! If the other boat is looking at your green one (ie approaching from your starboard) he is stand on - you take action. If red (from port) you are stand on. Obviously at night it's even easier as you can see his lights from a long way away - once you are used to it! Edited June 8, 2006 by duncan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 Rule of the Road. I found this book very useful when I first ever started going to sea. It's excellent for learning all the lights and contains all the official rules. You can work your way through it page by page testing yourself as you go. It's was alway a good one to keep on board if any one started quoting rule numbers and annexes etc. over the VHF. Simon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 i think i would move if a big tanker was coming for me i'm sure the fishing would never be that good to get in the way of a tanker sam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seamouse Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 i think i would move if a big tanker was coming for me i'm sure the fishing would never be that good to get in the way of a tanker sam Sam highlights something I've just been chatting about offline with someone. You are at anchor and a tanker is spotted bows-on to you. Obviously you get the engine running, lines up and prepare to slip the warp but does anyone attempt to contact the tanker? I've done it with the Royal Navy before now, via channel 16, and to be fair they altered course instantly. Would you use channel 13 (bridge to bridge) or ch16?? Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duncan Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 13 then 16; 14 if in Poole Harbours waters and Southampton's vts channel if in those waters ie I would start where he's likely to be listening or someone else might help! generally you get more problems over 'utopia way' than we do in Poole for this - the Barfleur used to give at least 50ft clearance to anchored fishing boats when leaving Poole Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Martin Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 I was anchored one evening out of Poole quiet happily fishing away then in the distance Barfluer appeared on a heading directly towards Maverick When he was about 2/3 miles away I called him up on the vhf and explained we were anchored in his path, the french guy came back and acknowleged he had seen us and that he would alter course which he did. I was a little worried about contacting him and did think about slipping anchor but the captain was very cordial. A bit long winded but the answer to your question is yes call them up but do also have a back up plan ready, just in case! Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blueboatdriver Posted June 8, 2006 Report Share Posted June 8, 2006 If you do have a problem with Barfleur call her on 14 as she always answer PHC on this channel from one hour away. If she doesn't answer you call PHC and they will definitely get her for you. The same goes for the Condor ferries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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