shytalk Posted November 19, 2008 Report Share Posted November 19, 2008 get your objections ready people i hear on the grapevine that southern sea fisheries circus is planning to introduce a bylaw forcing bag limits on all "unregistered unlicenced "craft which is cfo speak for all us nasty recreational sea anglers who go out plundering the fish that belong to the commercial fleet be afraid !!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Would you not think that if you are sensible that would not effect you? Or are you expecting stupidly low limits? something along the lines of 2 bass in 24hours or even 48 or 72 would be OK with me! As long as it was sensible I would agree (don't ask me to define sensible please!). Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newboy Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 I think Shytalk's (Peter Senior?) objection is based on the fact that they are (trying to) introduce limits on us recreational anglers while nothing is being done on the commercial boats netting/trawling up and down our coast who are really doing the damage to the fish stock. Fair is when both sides play to the rules, not one side subsidising the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Martin Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Kam it's Pete junior although I don't think the big boy will be offended. Bag limits would be all well and good if as you say others were held to account for the effect they are having on fish stocks, even if some commercial fishermen would be held to account for indiscretions some of them commit might make it more palatable but no instead it seems as if certain ssfc officers have a death wish against anglers. Why? I wonder could it be something to do with bruised egos and ongoing issues with the charter sector? who knows, what I do no is that when we anglers as a group asked for a no go area to fish for flounder in areas of Poole harbour the ssfc stated that they could not be seen to be biased or discriminatory towards one sector so instead introduced min size limits which affected all. This conservation measure was not dreamt up buy ssfc no it was a direct result of recreation anglers pushing for measures to conserve stocks, when have the commercial sector tried to conserve stocks? It now would appear that they (ssfc) are only to happy to be seen to be discriminatory against the one sector that at least tries to play the conservation game. SSFC will say that anglers are catching fish and selling on their catch! are they? if you know they are then you must know who they are? if you know who they are why don't you do your job and bring the offenders to task not tar us all with that brush. There is a meeting this evening at the Broadstone Conservative club with guest speaks from the SSFC perhaps some questions need to be asked of their representatives. Unfortunately I will not be able to attend but would ask members that do to ask pertinent questions and report back. The basis of the proposed bag limits are I believe as follows: Lobster 2 Crab 5 Great Scallop 24 Sea Bass 4 Cod 2 Clams (all species) 8KG Obviously the shellfish crab and lobster do not really effect us but 2 cod in the summer? Before a byelaw goes through they (the proposers) have to go out to consultation and I believe that this club should register itself with the ssfc as an interested party/stakeholder to be sure we receive proper notification of any future proposals rather than relying on information given us by friends Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Hmmmmmmm. I'd be prepared to defend this. As others have said - limits fine, but play fair and do it both sides. As Martin has said, 2 cod in the summer? Not worth running mid-channel for that.... Scallops? Shellfish - wont effect you chaps, but would for us diver types! 24?? Would be fine if that was a limit for 5 mins! The bass limit is reasonable IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
great white Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Like others I have no problem with Bag Limits in principle. But the thought of introducing them as a local bylaw and to target RSA is a Joke. If these do not have an effect on commercial fisherman what is the point. I am sure the cod must be down to the fact that commercials have had quotas and a ban, while reading in angling press and forums about private and charter boats catching and landing loads. You can almost see their point. are the limits mentioned per angler per day, per boat per day or What? If the SSFC are really trying to use this as a method of stock control then it MUST take in both commercials and RSA, I had better stop now as I am getting wound up by this as I type, and am probably not the best person to attend this meeting. Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petesnr Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 You know me-- calm, even tempered, docile, non-confrontational, no strong opinions, no axe to grind over conservation. I shall be there tonight representing the views expressed in Martin's post. Bag limits can only be used as a management measure within the context of an overall plan to improve/sustain the stock. Any measures targeted at one group of exploiters is not fishery management but is discriminatory, vindictive and divisive. The purpose of the fishery committee is to manage the fishery and this by-law is not an effective tool for management in my view. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Where is the Broadstone Labour Club and what time is the meeting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maverick Martin Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Where is the Broadstone Labour Club and what time is the meeting? Follow this link Tom http://www.pbsbac.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=8064 Martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
great white Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 Hi Peter Very good to hear that you are able to go tonight I hope that you get a chance to get the RSA angle accross in your usual style. Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shytalk Posted November 20, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 I think Shytalk's (Peter Senior?) objection is based on the fact that they are (trying to) introduce limits on us recreational anglers while nothing is being done on the commercial boats netting/trawling up and down our coast who are really doing the damage to the fish stock. Fair is when both sides play to the rules, not one side subsidising the other. # i appear to have had senior moment!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newboy Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 I think Shytalk's (Peter Senior?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Osprey Posted November 20, 2008 Report Share Posted November 20, 2008 If their argument is based on conservation of stocks, then presumably the rules will apply to shore anglers as well. If not, what is their argument based on? It would be interesting to see how they would police the beaches! Martyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swainiac Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 Will be a giggle seeing how they intend to police this byelaw. They cant police issues already in place, so I guess more on the list against the recreational angler, again shows how this group of airheads thinks they can bully the small, although not in Pete's case, guys!! Thanks for the heads up Peter. Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petesnr Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 Under heavy sedation after last nights meeting. Could not keep my cool. Without going into too much detail apparently the demise of the plaice and dabs between the piers and Southbourne is 'due to them having swum somewhere else' unquote. He would not discuss the 12metre rule due to court action impending. When questioned he said 'whats wrong with bag limits?' 'nothing', I replied, 'within the framework of a fishery management plan where proper size limits and limits on commercial catches are also in place' He could not see that limiting one section of the catchers whilst not another did not constitute management. I asked for the evidence backing up the suggested by-law and he said that it was a nationwide problem that unlicensed boats were landing and selling bass. I asked why the existing laws on buying and selling fish could not be invoked and he replied that it was not their responsibility but that of the MFA who were taking no action on small infringements despite SSFC passing on receipts etc. The general feeling of the meeting was the majority would be punished for the crime of a few and that there would be no benefit to the recreational sector from any of the proposals. The question about grandfather rights was brought up and he said that he would look into the specific case mentioned but added that no-one had informed them of the relevant information--as if the people concerned would!! He did say that the number of grandfather rights boats had diminished from 40something to 11 and that the desire of the fishery officer was to get rid of them all (and beam trawling). If anyone would like to chat about the meeting please call me. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 (edited) What Pete just said and: On arrival I said to Pete I wanted to sit quietly at the back as I was the first to admit to not fully understanding the issues. I couldn't help myself and was soon stuck in as it was very VERY clear that I had a far greater understanding than the fisheries officer. I don't think this says an awful lot as my 6 year old, Natasha, probably has a bit more understanding on fishery managment. I did feel a little sorry for the chap to start with. He was going to get a bit of a kicking and he knew it and his nervous look at the start was telling. The poor guy had given up an evening with his family to be with us and I flt he was due some credit. Until I realised that his job description would involve the odd evening as mine does weekends so stuff it, he was here to do his job. Which he proceeded to do by telling us that running SSFC costs nearly Edited November 21, 2008 by TomBettle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
great white Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 As Peter said, it sounds like the circus were in town. Probably good that I did not attend. 500k per year not very well spent Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djredrupp Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 just a quick question... how is this bag limit enforced on a private boat? Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petesnr Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 A little man will sit in his patrol boat in the harbour entrance and board your craft to examine your catch. They have these powers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djredrupp Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 http://www.explorethesouthwestcoastpath.co.../poole43_sm.jpg rather him than me! 1 - are they really gona be there through winter??? - 3deg celsius 2moz! 2 - What time frame is the limit based on? - number of anglers onboard (does the dog count? ) - time out fishing ( i.e. short or long trip) etc... tbh this sounds like something that will be so hard to fully enforce it will end up being ignored, similar to anglers selling their catch... (if that was enforced, there would be no need for this new limit surely?? ) also, wouldnt this lead to the failings already seen in the commercial market? : " oh ive caugnt my cod quota (yer right for me,... ), lets fish for conger now... oh no ive caught another cod, swallowed the hook, dead... lets throw it back!" Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 You know me-- calm, even tempered, docile, non-confrontational, no strong opinions, no axe to grind over conservation. thanks for representing us Peter,im sure you did us proud as you usually do. I only wish i was there to see it -i had to study for a course im on PJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shytalk Posted November 21, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 i think everybody should attend a southern sea fisheries circus quarterly meeting then everybody could see for themselves what sort of people are running the ssfc committee having spoken to the deputy cfo on the phone it comes as no suprise that people were not impressed with him , sensibility seems an alien concept there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 Did anyone see the good news this week about the revival of cod stocks in the North Sea? Apparently they are just "out there waiting to be caught" and because of public outcry about dumping fish the quota is being increase by 11% to prevent it. There was even talk about voluntary limits being imposed and managed by the commercial fleet themselves who then would police it as part of the overall conservation strategy. If the part about the industry policing itself is really true, no one needs to worry about bag limits. They Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manic Moore Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 (edited) Well not to set the cat amongst the pigeons and I agree with peters point about the overall strategy of conservation across all areas. But if all we ever do is wait for the the other side to do their bit I guess it will never happen. If the rec angler made the first steps and publicly declared it would agree to bag limits this would surely increase the pressure on the commercial sector to make consessions. I feel sometimes that we argue how these things would be policed etc etc. Its always easy to talk about how things won't work when perhaps an 80% solution might be the best we can achieve. When its all said and done when there are no fish left worth rec angling for and we are all playing golf or something, will we be saying to ourselves, were we any better than the commercial boys by just digging our heels in, had we taken the first steps would we have been still fishing? Just trying to put a more positive spin on a very difficult subject Oh god I bet Iv'e said it now. Edited November 21, 2008 by Manic Moore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul D Posted November 21, 2008 Report Share Posted November 21, 2008 Well this is what you are up against :- Parliament TV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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