Afishionado Posted November 18, 2006 Report Share Posted November 18, 2006 There's a possibility that we will be upgrading to a Quicksilver 580 or 630 next year. What opinions on these boats are there out there? We would still want to launch and recover ourselves but there is the possibility we might berth it a Cobbs too. Mad Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted November 18, 2006 Report Share Posted November 18, 2006 Mike, Mark B has had plenty of experinace of these. The 580 is what he has at the moment I think (or the 560?) the 630 is a stern drive version of the 640, which Mark has also had. Personally, from the few trips I've had out in them, I like the set up and the way they look, but this is all shadowed by the way they handle the sea - fine in a head sea, but I didnt like a following sea - I feel the COG is too high with the big wheelhouse and outboard. The 630 should be different. I would also look at the Arvors in this size which are exactly the same, but are inboard, with a lower COG. Also have a look at some of the range Tom sells. Just out of interest, why are you upgrading? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted November 18, 2006 Report Share Posted November 18, 2006 Mike, What Adam says about C of G is true especially if you look at Arvor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plaicemat Posted November 18, 2006 Report Share Posted November 18, 2006 Mike, have a chat with Tom about the new Jeanneau 585. I'm considering it and personally think it's a) better looking, better made and c) should handle better (IMHO). But what do I know? Terry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted November 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2006 Just out of interest, why are you upgrading? Well Mark my co owner has some money he wants to put into the boat and although we both love the Samurai we would prefer something with a cabin as we have been caught out in the rain and spray a bit this last year. We would still stick to a O/B power though as the weight of a diesel would mean having to hava a 4X4 as said, and for the odd occasions we would need to tow the cost is not justified. Moving to a mooring would mean we would use the boat more as we would not have the hassle of trailing in and out for a 3 hour evening trip. Mark looked at the Jeanneau at the S'oton boat show and was a bit underwhelmed by the finish, but very impressed by the Quicksilver. When the money looks to be a lot nearer I dare say we will be climbing over anything that floats before writing the cheque. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swainiac Posted November 18, 2006 Report Share Posted November 18, 2006 Mikey, the comments re. handling in a following sea are V true, the boat does tend to crab easily, and I feel, is arse light. The comfort the cabin offers is excellent, giving good stowage space, a small galley area for that ever welcome bacon sarnie and cup of splosh, with a good amount of deck space, even for the larger angler. Stability is excellent, when two of you are stood on one side of the boat, all in all, I'm very happy with it. On the negative side, the finish on some aspects are a tad lacking, on Marks old boat, the window leaked, the windscreen wiper housing leaked, the hatch ctaches broke, on our boat, the same can be said of the winscreen wiper box and hatch catches. If you can put up with that on a new boat....go for it....if not, look at other brands. Rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newboy Posted November 18, 2006 Report Share Posted November 18, 2006 I'd be very surprised if you can tow the 630 without a 4x4 or a very large engined car. A walk in cabin is just so nice on a boat, you'll never get wet, and no wind in the hair whatsoever. But can be quite scary if caught be a gust of side wind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinbad Posted November 19, 2006 Report Share Posted November 19, 2006 Terry Good luck on viewing the 585, has anyone spotted one yet ? Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted November 20, 2006 Report Share Posted November 20, 2006 Terry Good luck on viewing the 585, has anyone spotted one yet ? Paul Two now in stock in our Hamble office with one of them being rigged to come down to me "any day" now. Very smart looking boat and I stongly suggest the build quality / finish comment that Mike's friend had is reviewed. Take a far closer look at fixtures and fittings and how the whole boat is screwed together. There is a big difference between different brands. At the risk of sounding a wee bit biased, I personaly have found the Quicksilvers and Arvors to handle a little "differently" at sea, with a tendency to crab slightly. All will do the job and all will (on most days) put a big smile on your face. Speak to "Cascars" and "Nipper" (Mark) about their Quicksilver quality issues. On the flip side, all manufacturers have the odd Friday boat, but I think you'll find that there are several more Fridays in the week at Quicksilver than with many other brands. The 585 is still very towable with most larger family cars. And our 625 with a bigger vehicle (an SUV, transit, MPV etc). The 625 makes a cracking fisher for two, but is a squeeze for more as most of the space is taken up for creature comforts. The 585 has similar deck space to the Quicksilver 580, but a slightly higher finish inside and a little bit more styling (all in my opinion of course ) Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
plaicemat Posted November 20, 2006 Report Share Posted November 20, 2006 No, Paul, I haven't seen the actual boat, only photo's so far, but I have been very impressed with what I've seen. I will certainly be dropping down to have a closer look when one comes in to Poole; I was just waiting for the word. Terry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
great white Posted November 20, 2006 Report Share Posted November 20, 2006 Mike I am sure when you are getting nearer the time you will be having a good look around, at least you have a good contact for Jennaux's. IMHO all boats are a compromise and balance between, budget, size layout and finish. If we had more budget then I am sure we would be building a different boat, or more likely buying a finished one. But hopefully by carefull planing, spending and hard work we will finish up with a good offshore angling boat, that also has the comforts for a family boat. Good luck with your searching. Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul J Posted November 20, 2006 Report Share Posted November 20, 2006 Mark B should be able to comment on many Quicksilvers models, after all hes owned most of them at one time or another Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Afishionado Posted November 20, 2006 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2006 I am sure we will be down to have several looks at your boats Tom before the deed is done. Mad Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sinbad Posted November 20, 2006 Report Share Posted November 20, 2006 Tom If you are delivering it to Poole - can I come for a ride? You have my number Only - dont call out the RNLI this time.... Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted November 20, 2006 Report Share Posted November 20, 2006 I had a look at the new 585 on Jeanneu's main web site which also runs a video of the boat in action. Looks a fantastic trailable pocket cruiser that would satisfy both those fishing and family days out equally well. Only thing I've found with the closed wheelhouse type fishers is that 2 people can't sit in the cabin and fish in shelter because the bulkhead/sliding door is in the way. You have to sit out in the cockpit as the wind whistles round the sides of the wheelhouse and this gets a bit chilly. That Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 (edited) Gordon Interestingly on the new 585 you can choose open or closed wheelhouse. As you know we do fit the "gin palace" style patio doors rather than "solid" grp doors with small windows. Some don't like patio doors because they seem "posh", but the truth is they give enormously better visibility. With the layout of the new 585 both skipper and crew can sit inside with the doors closed and easily see out to the rods. Paul, In this instance the 585 is likely to come round by road, but don't worry, as soon as I have a test boat ready, those club members who have expressed an interest will be invited to come and try her. With a bit of wangling, I may be able to use her for the next PBSBAC tuition session (if one is planned). Tests like this, with anglers onboard are welcome. As you know, the 585 is a brand new model and we at Southern Motorboats and as a result, Jeanneau, will be keen to hear about any minor mods that us crticial anglers need to make fishing easier. Any little mods we discovered (I said little, not completely redesigning the hull - which it won't need) can easily be retro fitted to customer boats. Tom Edited November 21, 2006 by TomBettle Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cascars Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 My experiences of my 640 are on the link below: Pilothouse Problems I would also echo what others have said on here re handling in a following sea. It can be a real struggle sometimes in a big sea to keep in a straight line without broaching. On a normal day however she handles brilliantly and has a fair turn of speed, up to 28kts with a 100hp mariner 4 stroke. Overall I have been happy with the boat. I think all boats of any make and model are a compromise, you will never find everything perfect with any boat. If you decided to go for the Quicksilver I can thoroughly recommend Boating Mania in Upminster, their after sales service has been superb unlike reports I have heard of your more local dealer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Fox Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Broaching? That's scary. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomBettle Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Broaching in a head sea is very odd. A following sea, maybe, if trimmed wrong (nose too far down), or running too slowly... A head sea is the one that would generally cause a boat to slam and crash unless the speed is backed off and this can also be reduced by dropping the nose to present the V of the bow rather than the flat of the hull. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cascars Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 With any waves / swell of more than about 4-5ft behind you it is a matter of constantly keeping the boat at the same speed as the waves or it tends to turn the boat sideways on to the next one if too slow or being hit sideways by the one you have just come off the top of if too fast. Does that make more sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam F Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Tom, Read Cascars post again - it doesnt broach in a head sea, its a following sea as he describes second time around. Yes, I found it scary - the first time was on the Shambles, and it ended with the boat sideways sliding down the crest, all three of us in a pile on the floor and hot coffee everywhere!! Far from me being an expert, I feel some kind of a keel and or a lower COG would help. Its a shame, because if they could get one to handle as well as a Warrior, I would buy one - (pilothouses in general) but Im sceptical until proven wrong. Wouldnt mind a trip out in the 585 when she arrives though.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fugazi Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 Yes, I found it scary - the first time was on the Shambles, and it ended with the boat sideways sliding down the crest, all three of us in a pile on the floor and hot coffee everywhere!! Same thing happened to me off Hill Head in the Solent on a flat calm day running the Arvor 21 at about 10 knots. Suddenly the boat was overtaken by a wave that broached it over to the port gunnels throwing my father in law and I across the wheelhouse onto deck. I thought we were going right over it was that bad. What caused this incident? A tsunami? No, it was the wake from the Isle of Wight ferry. Never felt safe in that boat again, so glad when I swapped it for the Raider 18 which like the Warriors handles all sea condition without any fuss. However, I know not all pilot house boats are like this so a sea trial is essential to find out which ones are. Gordon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
great white Posted November 21, 2006 Report Share Posted November 21, 2006 I had a few simular incidents with Great White in big following seas She just did not have the speed to keep ahead of some waves the worst was a wave catching her on the stern quarter and knocking her off course, best to back off the power let the wave go then power up and straighten up. Only Time will tell what the Offshore will be like But we sea trailed one in a force eight at Padstow and I have been on Garys twice with the sea up and Prodigy was not bothered underway. In fact thats what caught us out on the 12th, we were cruising out to the wreck at about 20 knots so thought it would be fine, that was untill we started to think about anchoring Punching the sea on the way in at reduced revs also seemed fin at 12 knots Charlie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newboy Posted November 22, 2006 Report Share Posted November 22, 2006 Same here, I think all pilothouse owner had it one time or another. That was why I wouldn't take my old boat out when the forecast isn't good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shropfisher Posted November 25, 2006 Report Share Posted November 25, 2006 Before plunging into a sale, check out the Oquteau range as well, I have the 615, with 90 O/B, at 20 foot you can still tow with a family car and launch were you want, I used to launch out of Pwhelli, but the drive was close to 3 hours so I put her in Conwy, as soon as we sell up here I'll be in Cobbs or similar, But I am surrounded by Jennies at Conwy ( main dealer in Marina ) so I get to compare, and there is a QS 580 next to me at my berth, would I do a free swap ? No ! as Tom said, the Patio doors are great for visability, and light, deck space for 4 to fish, selve draing deck etc etc, Top speed around 28 - 30, cruise arounf 17, Fuel cons ? can't tell you only used 2 tanks all year ( well still got 3/4 of second tank ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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